Sex Coach From A Religious, Conservative Upbringing | Selena Luong S9 E7

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Niall Mackay00:41

Welcome to season nine of a Vietnam podcast, sharing the stories of people connected to Vietnam. My name's Niall Mackay, and I've been hosting this podcast since 2019. And I've been living in Vietnam since 2016. I wanted to know more about the people that are connected to Vietnam, Vietnamese and foreigners in Vietnam are around the world and share their.

So my guest today is a gen Z Siese. She was raised in a conservative and religious family without a proper sex education. After a lot of struggles with her own sex life, it is now her mission to become a sex love and relationship coach, to encourage more open conversations about sex and pleasure. Her biggest goal in her career as a sex coach is to be able to help sexually abuse victims.

Take back the fulfilling sex life they deserve after traumas today, we're gonna talk about being a sex loving relationship coach in Vietnam, normalizing conversations around sex and how the young Vietnamese can be given a different perspective about sex and unlearn. Everything that patriarchal society has taught my guest today is Lina alone.

Selena Luong01:55

Hi, thank you for having me.

Niall Mackay01:58

So this is the first ever offsite. A Vietnam podcast interview. Awesome. And in my rush to be here, I forgot one of the microphone cables. So we are currently sharing one microphone in the coffee shop in the block. So forgive us for this, but we hope this sound quality is still amazing.

Forgive us for this. Forgive me for this. Selena has nothing to do with this. So Selena let's get right into it. Tell us more about being a sex love and relationship coach in Vietnam.

Selena Luong02:32

Okay, thank you. So, first, I would like to say hello to everybody who's listening. And second of all, I'm a sex love and relationship coach in training, which means I'm expecting to get my certification somewhere next year.

And yeah. So that's what I'm doing here. And, besides, sex love and relationship coaching, I'm also a marketing and event executive, and I'm also a sex dance instructor. So yeah, that's what I'm doing. And well, it's a taboo in Vietnam is I think it's a taboo, every. In the word, when people mention sex, they'd be like, what?

Yeah. And you've introduced me. I grew up in such a very conservative and traditional family that my parents didn't mention anything about sex. And two, I have my first boyfriend, they would be like, don't get pregnant. And. And that's it. And they didn't even border to tell me how to not to get pregnant, you know?

Yeah. So that's what I experienced and yeah. That's how I grew up.

Niall Mackay03:52

yeah. And this is a common thing, not just in Vietnam, right? Like around the world. It's just an awkward thing. It's still weird. I was thinking about it on the way over here, obviously, knowing what we're gonna be talking about and. It's I've thought about this before I've had this conversation with people.

It's the one thing that almost everybody does, 90 plus percent of people love it, but nobody likes to talk about it. So I don't really know the answer. Why that, I mean, I guess I can figure out some answers why that is. It just, it seems to me though, very strange something that is done by everyone, but at the same time, it's so taboo.

So Taylor is more from your perspective, especially from a Vietnamese perspective, gen Z, why.

Selena Luong04:32

Well, we have been raised, that, sex is something for adults and adults means after the marriage. Like before marriage, you shouldn't touch yourself, you shouldn't, have any kind of sexual activities with your boyfriend.

And they mean here is that the, penetration. Like, for example, if you give oral sex or whatever, kind of sexual activities, they will not care. But when it comes to the penetration sex, they will be like, oh, because you're not a Virgin anymore. So yeah, that's what we were raised. And, as a Zen Z, and as, someone who's represent the young people, we believe that the Virgin.

it's not our identity, it's not identify if I'm a good person or a bad person. Yeah. I mean, you can still be a Virgin even though you give peoples oral sex. Right. yeah.

Niall Mackay05:35

So tell is more about then what does that mean? Being brought up in a religious conservative background? What was that like?

Where are you from in Vietnam?

Selena Luong05:42

Well, I'm from Saigon, born and raised here in Saigon. And, my home family is Buddhist. So, my mom told me that is not bright to have sex before marriage because the Buddhist, so it's like betray kind of thing. And I did believe her. When we first had the sexual activities, I just forget all of those that she, she told me.

yeah. And, also, my mom and dad, they would not mention anything. Like even if we were watching a movie together and it comes to the sexual scenes, they would just like, turn off the TV or just switch the channel right away. Yeah. And to be honest until I have my first boyfriend, like 16 years old, that's the first time ever.

I heard my mom told me, like, try to keep yourself clean, clean humans. Not to fuck anyone. Yeah.

Niall Mackay06:46

So we already mentioned you brought up religious conservative background and then that led to struggles with your own sex life. So do you want to talk more about that and then how that led you to become a sex love and relationship coach?

Selena Luong06:58

Sure. So, yeah, like I mentioned, we were taught that.

Wrong to touch ourselves and of course to have sex with people before we get marriage. So, before one of that, even when I have my boyfriend, I didn't have the gut to touch myself to masturbate. and then, when it comes to lockdown in 2020, that's the time when I could admit my boyfriend and, I was so horny , but like I mentioned, I, didn't have the gut to touch myself, but then he encouraged me.

He said, that will you now you have a lot of free time. So why not? Right. And I'd be like, okay, let's, give it a go.

so I, I did it. The masturbation, the penetration masturbation. Yeah, the penetrated masturbation. And it was so good. Thanks God. it was so good. And then, it gives me the, kind of like the, the weird feeling. It is a little bit strain. And somehow in my head, it popped up the term sex coach, just in my head, like randomly, like, I didn't know what it was, so I just Google it and then I found out, oh, wow.

Okay. So this is a sex coach and, this is what your do, because first I love. And, and second of all, it involves a lot of thing, like, giving people, sex, education lessons, or giving people the tune in techniques that they can heal themselves from sexual trauma, which I've been experiencing.

And that's what led me here to be this love and relationship coach that, My biggest goal is to empower women and grown people to just be proud of their sexuality and, feel comfort with the body.

Niall Mackay08:59

So what was the initial reaction? Did you tell your appearances? I mean, I know not just in Vietnam and most of Asia, if you tell your parents you're gonna be anything other than a doctor, a lawyer, an engineer. Or something like that you are gonna get slapped down and told don't be stupid and going to have these conversations all the time that people want to be designers or artists or actors.

So what was the conversation when you said to your mom and dad? Hey mom and dad. I don't wanna be a doctor or a lawyer, an engineer. I'm gonna be a sex coach. How did that go?

Selena Luong09:32

okay. So I did have to ask my, dad for the tuition. For the sex coaching program. And when I mentioned about this, he asked me one question, why do you want to teach people about sex even though you're not marriage yet?

Yeah, because the concept of not having sex, the format thing, and then I replied, well, because I'm not marriage yet. It doesn't mean that I haven't had. right. I mean, well, yeah, and then I, told him that there's a lot of things that young people experience that they don't know what they're doing because they just don't know nobody ever teach them.

Yeah. And that's what I wanna do. I wanted to make a. for young people in Vietnam and especially the women.

Niall Mackay10:31

I cannot imagine your dad's reaction. Not only you tell him you wanna be a sex coach, you wanna be a sex coach cuz you love sex and you wanna teach other people to love sex. That must have been a great conversation.

so where, do you actually enroll to do this coach? Is it international or is it offered here in Vietnam?

Selena Luong10:50

it is called love university that based in Los Angeles, California, and the days, and is an online course. that I can study self pace. And when I finish the course, I will have to, do like 10 assignments and have a exam, to graduate and get my certification.

Niall Mackay11:13

And then to what other topics that you cover in the

Selena Luong11:16

course? The first one, which I has just finished the model is about healing. So in the first modern, I learned how to help people to heal from their sexual trauma, how to heal from the pain they have during sex, which usually comes from the brand because sex comes from the brand, not between your legs and, what else?

like how to heal from when you lose someone you love or. When you experience something that give you kind of, depression? Yeah. The first module is about healing and, actually now I'm, I'm offering the free coaching session. for people who just, want to share their stories or share their traumas or whatever it is struggling with with me, is a free, free of charge session.

And they can donate, how much they want to for a non-profit organization of sexual abuse children in Southeast Asia. Yeah.

Niall Mackay12:24

Yeah. That's amazing because I. people probably, I don't know. What's the, well, my first, before I go into that, what's then the reaction from your parents you've told us what's the reaction from people in general.

You obviously have a Facebook page, obviously from our conversation. You're very open about it. It's not hidden. you can tell people what you just got delivered just before, just as I walked in. So there's obviously a very open thing in your life, which anytime I meet somebody who's just very open about, so.

And I don't want to say that answer for you, but what I've experienced is it just breaks down any barriers. As soon as that person is just open, without shame about it, about something that may be shameful or maybe hidden as soon as they're open about it, it breaks down every barrier. And then you're just like, oh, okay.

So I hope I haven't just answered my question for you, but what has been the reaction from people in general when they see this as your public?

Selena Luong13:14

, that's a very fun experience for me. lately I've, been participate in a lot of networking events that people usually ask, like, what, do you do for a living?

I'll be like, I do sex and people are like, what . And I was like, I'm just kidding. I'm a sex coach. And they, were like, okay, what is a sex coach? It's not purple at all in Vietnam. So yeah. a lot of time I, do get, the support from people, because they do believe that sex education is super important, especially for the young people.

And also they believe that it's just a normal thing. Like why do people ever shame somebody else for having sex? Right. But, of. There will be people who not support me at all, especially well, boomers . Yeah, they would be like, uh, she must be a slut or something like that. I get slut shaming a lot, my whole life, even though I'm only 25 years old.

yes. So yeah, some people support me and some people don't, but at the end of the day, I still believe. The value I'm giving to the society, to the young people, to the next next generations is the important thing to do. So. Yeah, I believe in myself and for those who don't support me, they can just fuck off.

Niall Mackay14:49

Well, do you ever get people that then take that as, oh, she's a sex coach. She's using your she's a slut and I'm gonna hit on her. I'm gonna, she's gonna be easy. Like, is that a, a common reaction?

Selena Luong15:03

Well, they would not say it straight to my face, but some lot of times we would be behind my back and well, for those kind of people, I would try to just avoid them and block them.

If they keep, like confront me or whatever.

Niall Mackay15:21

And then, so what has the reaction been then from the young people? Like you say, obviously totally different generation from the boomers. I love that that's become a total insult now, like okay. Boomer. but yeah, so what's been the reaction from the young people, because I guess as well, it's developing so fast in so many ways and.

I'm just amazed. Even yesterday, driving around district one and I'm looking around, I'm like, wow, this city has just come out of nowhere. But then at the same time, it's also developing in so many other ways. You can see it manifest in terms of the buildings, but there's so much other development going on in the background as well.

So how do you see that with the young people, with the sexual development as well, and let's be honest as well with the advent of pornography like that. I. Would not have been prevalent, I don't know, 10, 15, 20 years ago. I'm not sure, but now obviously that's prevalent. So Vietnamese people in general, Vietnamese young people are exposed to the wider world in a million different ways.

So how has that manifested?

Selena Luong16:21

Well, when I mentioned at MSX coach with the young people, like 99% of them supporting me, and, On may this year, one group of the students from a very famous university in ho city, they invited me to be a guest speaker for a talk show about, toxic relationships and had to get, uh, safe sex at their age.

So yeah, a lot of young people are supporting me and really appreciated.

Niall Mackay16:51

So another younger generation, this is what I see. With the young Vietnamese gen Z. I don't even know what gen Z is. What is that

Selena Luong16:58

like? Zen Z is like, people were born from 1997 to 2005. I remember. Yeah,

Niall Mackay17:06

fuck off.

I was born in 1982. That's why I don't know this stuff. now I've forgot my own question. The point I was making. Oh yeah. Young Vietnamese people are at this crazy crossroads that I see. I mean, every generation is I guess, but maybe Vietnamese people even more so, so I'm just thinking from my perspective, obviously I come from a totally different world to my parents.

There was no internet, all of this stuff, so that's not that different to a young Vietnamese person than their parents. Right. But I think the biggest difference is Vietnam has been closed off from the world for many. economically and whatnot. obviously it has a background in war and famine and, extreme poverty.

And now in 10, 15, 20, the last 20 years, especially, it's just rapidly coming out of that. And so these young people, gen Z, like you say, they life to me is extremely different from the generation before then. So my life is different to the generation before Maine and my country of. but the gap between the generations here is even bigger and exposure to sex and sexual attitudes is just one of them.

Because I guess as I just, as I'm thinking, you know, even in the, the west, we had like the sexual revolution in the sixties, right. You don't know about this. No. The sixties was like the sexual revolution where people. Going crazy with sex, like sex, drugs, and rock and roll and woods, the original Woodstock.

And I saw this video. I can't remember the name of it. I, quite like them. They put two people together in a room, either like a mom and a dad, sorry, a mom and a, or, and a son or daughter or a couple that have just broken up like these. They put these people together and then they, he asked them a series of interesting questions.

And if they don't wanna answer the question, they have to take a show. I think it's called. And uncut, right? Yeah. Yeah. And I remember one, and it was like a son and a mom. The mom was like a boomer and the son was in probably gen Z. And one of the questions he flipped over was, have you ever had a threesome or take a shot?

You know? And so the mom answered it and she was like, yeah, And the sun's obviously shopped and the mum was like, like the sixties, like, you know, that's what we did. And I just, it really made me realize, like, we don't know what the older people have done for one as well. so I guess to go right back to my point, though, in the west and America and the UK, I don't know about Australia and the rest of the west, but probably mostly the sixties and the seventies were the sexual revolution.

It was when women started to, Find their feet sexually. I dunno how to put that correctly, but that's not correct. Find their feet sexually, but it's when women started to become more sexual and more accepted, you know, and I guess Vietnam has never had that.

Selena Luong19:46

Yeah. I mean, like you said that, young Vietnamese people are, learning very fast. because of the internet and everything haves. To the internet, they can learn a lot of things bad and the good things as well. So that's why the sex education here is really important. because for example, if a teenager, a boy teenager, he watches porn so that he can understand the concept of sex.

Then he will become such a, person that expect a woman to. Like porn stars. They have to get big boobs and everything, you know? So that is like super wrong because porn is for entertaining. Right. So, yeah. That's why the sex education here is really important, even though they have the assess to the internet or whatever, but they still have to learn what is right and was not.

Niall Mackay20:39

And we mentioned this in the beginning as well. One of the barriers you wanna break down is the, patriarch. System. And, as I've got, not the patriarchal system, you're laughing, but the patriarch, what was it? You said that breakdown, not the entire patriarchy, but what was it? You said?

Selena Luong20:55

I said I wanted to help people to learn what co society has touched them because usually, it's a lot of Al gender.

Yeah.

Niall Mackay21:08

That's what I meant to say. And so again, as I'm getting older, just turned 40 it's things that I would being a male. I would never see these things. And as I get older and you start to learn about it and just small things like the language and whatnot, you're like, oh yeah, that's super patriarchal.

So two questions on that first one is Vietnam is ruled by women. From what I see either behind the scenes or in front of the scenes, Vietnam is ruled by women. Oh, my goodness. Yes, it is. So second who controls the money in the house who runs the household? Women run the household, women run everything here.

Vietnamese women are the strongest women in the world. All women are right. Look at any politician, any guy doing innocent? You know, there's a woman behind them telling them what to do every night, cuz that's how my wife works. Every good thing I do is because my wife suggested that I do it and then I go and do it.

So. But Vietnam is very patriarchal as well. So how do you teach people to unlearn that? And I do think there are very strong women in Vietnam

but to me that's in Vietnam is what's really different is that women are very strong. I see. Anyway, they, rule a lot of things. They run a lot of things. Company I used to work for every senior manager was a woman. but then at the same time, it's very patriarchal. So how do you break that down and how do you teach people to unlearn that?

Selena Luong22:27

Okay. So, a learn here is that they need to. Like forget, some of the things like not everything, right? Some of the things related to themselves, for example, like the girl should be, settled down and, just be a housewife after you get marriage and just, gift birth and raise a child as a woman's job.

And you should be proud of it. I mean like yeah, of course being a mother is, is so great, but I mean, it's not what I want women to understand that they have to. I mean, I want them to know that they have a choice between not or to give birth. And for example, like I learned some kind of shame around the sex, for example, if you touch yourself, that's.

that's what I want them to unlearn. and like a lot of thing, like for example, the patriarchal society touched them about the monogamy. Yeah. Relationship. I mean, that's your choice. If you want to have a monogamy relationship or you want to have like a poly. That's depends on you.

It's your fucking life. You live it, right? That's what I want people to know that they do have a choice to leave their life. How the hell they want to.

Niall Mackay23:46

So we are gonna have to wrap this up because somebody was late and it wasn't Selena and there's only two of us here. And so tell people what's next for you, where can they get in touch with you?

And if someone wants to reach out for you and wants some help, how can you help them? And what can you do?

Selena Luong24:01

Thank you. Okay. So I do have a fan page, it's called less talk sexuality and, on the fan page, I do. Let people book, appointments with me, which I've mentioned before, that is free for now. And it is a donation base, that you can donation how much you want for an non-profit organization of sexual abuse children.

And also I do have a Facebook group, is called. Maybe we should talk about sex. That the biggest goal for the group is to just normal. Because I put in the description, I said that. So, you can easily tell people, like I do like tennis, I do like to eat pizza. So why can't you say I do like to fuck, right?

That's why I want people to say. Yeah. And yeah, that's how you can connect with me on my fan page. Let's talk sexuality. And there you go.

Niall Mackay25:01

All right. So we're gonna finish up with the final questions. I ask everyone at the end of the episode, and then Selena is gonna run off to her dance class. So question one, what one reason would you use to persuade someone to come to Vietnam?

Selena Luong25:16

Good food and good.

Niall Mackay25:19

So I always like to have balance. I'm gonna ask the opposite. What one reason would you use to persuade someone not to come to Vietnam?

Selena Luong25:27

Okay. Not to come to Vietnam. Let me think. Jesus, this is a very hard one. my response is that maybe because it's too hot, you cannot stand it. Yeah. It's really hot.

Niall Mackay25:40

It's ridiculously hot, especially right now, you know, that having like the heat wave in the UK and I was talking to my sister and she's like, oh, it's so hot here.

And I can't remember it's in the thirties. I sent her a screenshot of the weather. It was last week. Not, not today. I'm not even sure what it is today, but last. The feels like temperature was 42 degrees and that's pretty normal here. That's not abnormal. She's like, how do you live in that? Like, I don't know.

We just get used to it. I don't know. Next one. What is a common scam in Vietnam?

Selena Luong26:09

Well, people would just call you and say that you own them a lot of money. Yeah. And when I hear. I usually respond like, hi, I do not speak Vietnamese and they would just like, hang up on me.

Yeah.

Niall Mackay26:27

Well, I mean, yeah, that would be my response. They could be saying anything to me and I would just be like, I don't speak Vietnamese. And then, yeah. alright, next question. What's something you hear about Vietnam. That's not true.

Selena Luong26:40

Is poor well, I mean, we, we used to be poor like a long time ago, but for now I think people, especially young people would love to make it rain, you know, as, long as, they find something they really like, they would just spend money for it. Yeah.

Niall Mackay27:00

What question would you like to ask the next guest

Selena Luong27:03

Okay. The next guess here is my question for you. what do you think? What was your first reaction when you know someone who is a sex coach that tries to normalize sex? Yeah. What's your reaction? What's your thought? That's my question.

Niall Mackay27:21

That's a good one. I'm excited to hear the answer.

And last question. If Vietnam was a person, how would you describe them?

Selena Luong27:28

Traditional but hot. . Yeah, literally hot.

Niall Mackay27:35

Like the girl that wore the sea through OEI recently traditional OEI, but sea. Traditional, but well, Selena long. Thank you very much. I'm sorry. We don't have more time to talk. I'm sorry. I was late.

Uh, you can blame me for all of that. I hope that the listeners have enjoyed this episode offsite, the first episode ever recorded offsite. So if it has gone well, and this is listenable, we will maybe do more of these in the future. So Selena good luck with your mission with your goal. It's a really inspir.

Because I think, you know, like you said way in the beginning, it's just so weird. Isn't it, people hear the three letters se X and you either get titillated excited or shocked, or there's so many different reactions, and I probably had all, all of them as well, but then when you hear about your goal is to help people with sexual trauma, from sexual abuse.

And we didn't really even get into that. But I mean, that's just something that's so unspoken of, I guess, so unheard of. Sexual abuse, as we know, no more than we ever knew before is rampant. It's just ridiculous. and yeah, there must be such severe trauma with that. And I can't imagine how difficult it is to then come back from that.

So it's really inspiring that that's something that you want to help people with because they should be able to continue to have a normal. Even after that. So thank you so much, Selena for joining us on our Vietnam podcast and we're excited to see what you do next.

Selena Luong29:00

Thank you for having me have a great stay, everyone.

Niall Mackay29:04

Cheers.

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